Reddit and its partners use cookies and similar technologies to provide you with a better experience. Cohorts outside of the United States ( I dont know what percentage of the LEAP people get the offer). The national average salary for a LEAP Program is $62,706 per year in United States. IBM has an apprenticeship program to hire workers with little or no formal training. The estimated total pay for a LEAP Program is $77,370 per year in the United States area, with an average salary of $62,321 per year. It was hard for me to decide what I should focus on besides learning data structures and algorithms. The hybrid by design approach at all our locations around the world will provide a high-quality experience while keeping the health and safety of our employees, interns, and their families at our highest priority. 5 Benefits of LeetCoding (Solving Data Structures & Algorithms Problems), 10 Things You Should Do When Getting Rejected By The Microsoft LEAP Program, Self-taught v. Bootcamp v. CS Degree How to Become A Developer, How to Deal with Rejection When Applying for Software Developer Jobs, 5 Things Ive Learned After 6 Months of Being A Junior Developer. Salaries estimates are based on 4 salaries submitted anonymously to Glassdoor by a Microsoft LEAP Apprentice employees. As the COVID-19 situation continues to evolve, Microsoft Leap is following Microsoft company guidance to make decisions about events and in-person learning. Engineering jobs are in high demand with workers receiving generous compensation packages and bonuses. Leap is following Microsoft company guidance to make decisions about events and in-person learning. Technical Program Managers lead and coordinate cross-team efforts to drive engineering solutions to technical challenges. Developing great products takes many talented individuals to fill several roles throughout the company. For information on minimum requirements to apply, visit our Application Process page. Please follow us on LinkedIn, Facebook and/or Twitter for details on which cohort locations are available for each application window. if(typeof ez_ad_units != 'undefined'){ez_ad_units.push([[300,250],'selftaughtsoftwareengineer_com-banner-1','ezslot_2',109,'0','0'])};__ez_fad_position('div-gpt-ad-selftaughtsoftwareengineer_com-banner-1-0');She was in the LEAP program at the time. Full stack engineer. page. Leap is following Microsoft company guidance to make decisions about events and in-person learning. Accountant salaries ($50k) Truck Driver jobs. Copyright 20082023, Glassdoor, Inc. "Glassdoor" and logo are registered trademarks of Glassdoor, Inc. { "name": "Native_infosite_salary_detail_fluid_en-US","id": "div-AdSlot-ld227g8b", "fluid": true }, average salary for a LEAP Program is $62,706 per year in United States. Instead of spending days or weeks looking up apprenticeship programs you can apply to, grab a copy of this ebook and save yourself hours of clicking online. Grab a copy of the ebook and start applying now! In no way did I think I was qualified. What is the pay outlook for Product & Project Management? Interview questions will focus on the following areas. If you are thinking of becoming a Microsoft LEAP Apprentice or planning the next step in your career, find details about, Microsoft Microsoft LEAP Apprentice salaries - 3 salaries reported, InConsulting Microsoft LEAP Apprentice salaries - 1 salaries reported, the role, the career path and salary trajectory of a Microsoft LEAP Apprentice. application dates, and photos of our amazing participants. All .css-jiegi{font-size:15px;line-height:24px;color:#505863;font-weight:700;}How accurate does $111,654 look to you? I had a portfolio website that I built using HTML, CSS, JavaScript, Flask, Django and some other technologies. And I got invited to an interview the second time I applied. About Microsoft Pathways Customer Service Engineer Data Analyst Software Engineer Software Support Engineer Related posts: Do you know if that same person got hired right after the apprenticeship or took months after it ended? Cashier salaries ($18k) Pharmaceutical Sales jobs. upskillunconventional talent for employability into the technology industry worldwide. Microsoft Leap is a full-time commitment. Before I learned about the rejection, however, there was another application period added primarily for software engineers. How much does a LEAP Program in United States make? be virtual or in-person based on local state and country guidance. I was overjoyed that I had gotten accepted into an appreticeship program at one of the most prestigious tech companies in the world. Pathways As the COVID-19 situation continues to evolve, Microsoft Leap is following Microsoft company guidance to make decisions about events and in-person learning. cohorts in the United States will be virtual until further notice. Youre offline. Web Developer at a consulting firm in Washington DC. A detailed description of each of the program including mission, duration, tracks, experience requirement, locations, application period, application process, finances (i.e. Cohorts outside of the United States will be virtual or in-person based on local state and country guidance. I got rejected the first time I applied to LEAP. Apprentices then spend 12 weeks working with their team. I have an interview coming up. Cohorts outside of the United States will be virtual or in-person based on local state and country guidance. These software engineer apprenticeship programs can help you jumpstart and build a long-term and rewarding career in tech.if(typeof ez_ad_units != 'undefined'){ez_ad_units.push([[300,250],'selftaughtsoftwareengineer_com-large-mobile-banner-1','ezslot_3',113,'0','0'])};__ez_fad_position('div-gpt-ad-selftaughtsoftwareengineer_com-large-mobile-banner-1-0');if(typeof ez_ad_units != 'undefined'){ez_ad_units.push([[300,250],'selftaughtsoftwareengineer_com-large-mobile-banner-1','ezslot_4',113,'0','1'])};__ez_fad_position('div-gpt-ad-selftaughtsoftwareengineer_com-large-mobile-banner-1-0_1'); .large-mobile-banner-1-multi-113{border:none !important;display:block !important;float:none !important;line-height:0px;margin-bottom:7px !important;margin-left:auto !important;margin-right:auto !important;margin-top:7px !important;max-width:100% !important;min-height:250px;padding:0;text-align:center !important;}. To qualifiy for this positions we urge you to read carefully the job requirements before applying. Microsoft Leap offers an immersive 16-week experience for those who have a base foundation of technical training. Microsoft does not provide accommodation or match participants with roommates. Any advice on how best to prepare? Immigration sponsorship will not be provided. Current authorization to work in the United States or residency in the country location of your cohort. The Glassdoor community relies on people like you to share accurate salary info to promote fair compensation everywhere. Your input helps Glassdoor refine our pay estimates over time. Interviews are projected to take place in early January 2022 (stated by the Leap webinar speaker in September). Selected individuals will be invited to interview for Microsoft Leap. Lots of bootcamp graduates apply, but self-taught programmers, and professionals with a 2+ year career break are also welcome. There was a person in my team who got full time offer from LEAP. if(typeof ez_ad_units != 'undefined'){ez_ad_units.push([[250,250],'selftaughtsoftwareengineer_com-box-4','ezslot_8',104,'0','0'])};__ez_fad_position('div-gpt-ad-selftaughtsoftwareengineer_com-box-4-0');I did a lot of searching online and found a couple of great apprenticeship programs. Salaries estimates are based on 9 salaries submitted anonymously to Glassdoor by a LEAP Program employees. Copyright 2008-2023, Glassdoor, Inc. "Glassdoor" and logo are registered trademarks of Glassdoor, Inc, Construction, Repair & Maintenance Services, Anonymously share your pay to help the community. The "Most Likely Range" represents values that exist within the 25th and 75th percentile of all pay data available for this role. If you are thinking of becoming a Microsoft LEAP Apprentice or planning the next step in your career, find details about the role, the career path and salary trajectory of a Microsoft LEAP Apprentice. But I still wanted to apply to get exposure to the application process. Apprenticeship salaries will vary depending on the profession and the type of apprenticeship (i.e., union apprenticeship vs. non-union apprenticeship). We post announcements of upcoming cohorts, Engineering offers ample opportunity for growth and development with transferable skills across an array of fields from software, supply chain and logistics to aerospace. Please follow us on our Microsoft Leap LinkedIn page for any The majority pay between $39,000 to $104,000 per year. The 16-week full-time program is available across various tech fields. To remain competitive, job-seekers should consider specialization or skill-specific programs such as coding boot-camps or certifications. The estimated additional pay is $15,277 per year. Hey yall, I recently graduated from a bootcamp, shout out Ironhack. Apprentices learn for four weeks and gain hands-on, practical experience for 12 weeks. cohorts in the United States will be virtual until further notice. Microsoft Leap is full-time, 16-week immersive experience. One of the biggest changes I added to the second application was that I was taking the AWS Developer Certificate course on ACloudGuru. best: fast, comprehensive, worst: relatively expensive. Each interview was about 45 minutes. cohorts in the United States will be virtual until further notice. I was terrified of the interviews, but I was also overjoyed. Engineering jobs are in high demand with workers receiving generous compensation packages and bonuses. Don't know their salaries, but I suspect it just depends on the team, as pretty much everything at Microsoft. Privacy Policy. These numbers represent the median, which is the midpoint of the ranges from our proprietary Total Pay Estimate model and based on salaries collected from our users. Copyright 2008-2023, Glassdoor, Inc. "Glassdoor" and logo are registered trademarks of Glassdoor, Inc, Construction, Repair & Maintenance Services. It was designed for people from non-traditional career backgrounds. The highest salary for a Microsoft LEAP Apprentice in United States is $107,942 per year. LEAP Program 2 Salaries submitted $111,138 $90,151 | $20,987 $86K $145K 1 Viewing 1 - 20 of 20 Salaries > Microsoft View Data as Table Latest Rating about Pay and Benefits at Microsoft 5.0 Overall Benefits Rating 4.5 MS matches 50% of your contribution up to IRS limit - Anonymous, Dec 9, 2022 See all 4489 Employee Benefit Reviews I accepted the interview request and was able to pick two time slots within a week when I could be interviewed. upcoming Of course, and it's led to a solution where we thought outside the box and went for creating something that was unique. Microsoft lueA71 2 interviews one hour each. Youre offline. I heard about this program at Microsoft about getting bootcamp graduates into Microsoft but, tbh it sounds a little sus. 30 were on the software engineer track (SWEs), and six on the Technical Program Manager track (TPMs). drives our work, and pushes us to challenge the status quo every day. And that was a big mistake on my part. I heard about this program at Microsoft about getting bootcamp graduates into Microsoft but, tbh it sounds a little sus. She also reviewed the two essays which were part of my application. Additional information will be provided upon acceptance into the program. In 2015, we launched Microsoft Leap to introduce more people to work in the tech industry. The estimated additional pay is $23,088 per year. We dont just value differences, we seek them out. Since January 2017, more than 90 percent of apprentices who successfully completed an apprenticeship program made an average of $70,000 per year, according to the U.S. Department of Labor. Please select your location below to . wawaffle 1 yr. ago. No one asked me to reverse a linked list. But I am glad that I had the opportunity to go through so many challenges to truly learn more about myself and see the boundaries I can push. The estimated additional pay is $11,431 per year. The Glassdoor community relies on people like you to share accurate salary info to promote fair compensation everywhere. Microsoft Leap participants will be sponsored by Microsoft or one of our partner companies but are not employees. Cookie Notice Ten-weeks of engineering project with an immersion with a Microsoft product team. Please follow us on LinkedIn, Facebook and/or Twitter for details on which pathways we are targeting for each application window. How to teach yourself coding and get a job as a software engineer. The national average salary for a Microsoft LEAP Apprentice is $93,412 per year in United States. To remain competitive, job-seekers should consider specialization or skill-specific programs such as coding boot-camps or certifications. Youre offline. Nov 21, 2021 How to Deal with Rejection When Applying for Software Developer Jobs . The program aims at adding . Please check your spam folder if you have not received any emails from the program.Due to the high volume of applications, we are unable to respond to individual inquiries on the status of applications. But I didnt want to be overly optimistic. Marketing salaries ($60k) Accountant jobs. My cohort had 36 people. The estimated additional pay is $48,553 per year. Any thoughts?For those who want to say grind LeetCode, the problem is I can't even land interviews.#engineering #software #swe #apprenticeship, Go to company page cohort updates. These numbers represent the median, which is the midpoint of the ranges from our proprietary Total Pay Estimate model and based on salaries collected from our users. Not only is Microsoft Leap launching new cohorts across the country and the globe, but its also re-launching the lives of countless individuals looking to make an impact. Carefully read this page before starting the application process. Microsoft Leap participants are change catalysts and change multipliers: they bring a diverse set of personal experiences and cognitive abilities to their work as well as to their colleagues and communities at Microsoft. Here is my experience in my 1st attempt. Do you have an idea on what salary they are given after accepting them from LEAP? Were constantly looking for new ways to create unconventional entry points for talent and leverage the skills and experiences of talent from outside the traditional academic paths. However, we encourage participants to connect with fellow cohort members who may be able to recommend housing options. After your application is reviewed, you will receive a letter of declination or invitation to interview via our chosen contracting company. Please follow us on our Microsoft Leap LinkedIn page for any roles The estimated total pay for a Microsoft LEAP Apprentice is $116,389 per year in the United States area, with an average salary of $93,336 per year. Follow Microsoft Leap on social media. I could have stayed at my current job or gotten a new yet similar position at another company. The idea of [Microsoft] Leap started from a business objective of improving the inclusion and diversity of our engineering. Both joined right after their programs ended. The Microsoft Leap Apprenticeship Program's mission is to recruit, develop, and upskill unconventional talent for employability into the technology industry worldwide. that are essential will be onsite. Visit our Pathways pages to see detailed eligibility requirements for each pathway. This number represents the median, which is the midpoint of the ranges from our proprietary Total Pay Estimate model and based on salaries collected from our users. New comments cannot be posted and votes cannot be cast. 33 open jobs for Microsoft leap program. will FYI, one person got level 59, another 60. And the interview request was like a flickering light that told me that maybe I was heading in the right direction. But the fact that I could proceed to the next round, to me, was like the light at the end of the tunnel. About 70% of Leapers come from different industries. December interviews are a possibility, but historically, candidates for a February/March Leap cohort have their interviews in January, after the holidays. Check the location of your cohort; while you may be qualified, you may or may not be eligible, based on the Sponsoring teams change with each cohort and are dependent on the needs of the business. The interview process is largely the same as for external hires but you get good recommendations from your mentor (obviously, if you did well on the program). The "Most Likely Range" represents values that exist within the 25th and 75th percentile of all pay data available for this role. Grab a copy of my ebook List of 25 Software Engineer Apprenticeship Programs where I discuss in detail a list of 25 software engineer apprenticeship programs that you can apply to. These numbers represent the median, which is the midpoint of the ranges from our proprietary Total Pay Estimate model and based on salaries collected from our users. Learn and adopt relevant new technologies, tools, methods, and processes. Part of me felt that I had done well on the interviews. Also hear Melissas storya single mom and former casino dealer who found success after completing her cohort. If you are thinking of becoming a Microsoft LEAP Apprentice or planning the next step in your career, find details about, Microsoft Microsoft LEAP Apprentice salaries - 3 salaries reported, InConsulting Microsoft LEAP Apprentice salaries - 1 salaries reported, the role, the career path and salary trajectory of a Microsoft LEAP Apprentice. It's part of a "new collar" jobs initiative that helps workers transition into tech roles. Microsoft Leap follows company, local state, and country guidance when making decisions about in-person events and learning. Participants are employed by a contracting company and are designated as such for the duration of the program. It was definitely one of the best moments I had ever had. The lowest salary for a LEAP Program in United States is $38,921 per year. We post announcements of upcoming cohorts, The Microsoft Leap application portal is now live and accepting applications for the Software Engineer, Technical Program Manager, Product Manager, and UX Designer cohort! Although I knew my chances were low, I was still devastated. No. will I got discouraged and stopped LeetCoding out of frustration. I applied twice to the Microsoft LEAP Apprenticeship program for UX Design. Cashier jobs. The highest salary for a LEAP Program in United States is $101,026 per year. Been there for about a year and three quarters. cohorts in the United States will be virtual until further notice. I recently got accepted to the Software Engineer Apprenticeship Program with Microsoft Leap (Redmond, WA location). I think the biggest hurdle for me was that I had neither a degee in Computer Science nor work experience as a developer. Difficulty varies a lot by interviewer. Aug 13, 2020 6 3 + View 1 more reply. Technical Program Managers (TPMs) drive the development and implementation process of programs, products, and services. The only problem is that I'm not sure if leaving my current job to attend the apprenticeship is worth.A little bit of background on me is that I attended a bootcamp, don't have a degree, and work at a startup. The interview process will consist of two 45-minute online interviews. Thats when I decided to look into apprenticeship programs, hoping that an apprenticeship would help me bridge the gap to tech and reduce the risk of hiring a career-changer like me for companies. I recently got into the Microsoft LEAP apprenticeship. After learning that I was applying to LEAP, she gave me a lot of advice on my resume and portfolio. Additional pay could include cash bonus, commission, tips, and profit sharing. The estimated total pay for a LEAP Program at Microsoft is $111,654 per year. All cohorts in the United States will be virtual until further notice. Interesting. I personally know 2 people who got full-time offers at Microsoft after LEAP program. A Bonus section where I answer the most frequently asked questions about applying to apprenticeship programs. Find jobs for microsoft leap program. Microsoft Leap combines in-classroom learning with hands-on engineering projects, working on real teams and real products within our organization such as Azure, Xbox, Bing, and Office365. Based on 1 salaries posted anonymously by Microsoft Leap Program employees in Reston. On February 6, 2020, I got an offer letter informing me that I had been accepted into the Microsoft LEAP Program. Read how Microsoft Leap is unlocking high-tech career opportunities for talent with non-traditional backgrounds. Developer at a consulting firm in Washington DC moments I had been accepted into the technology worldwide. Of technical training be able to recommend housing options details on which microsoft leap program salary are! Can not be cast total pay for a LEAP Program at Microsoft $ 38,921 per.. Another 60 pretty much everything at Microsoft about getting bootcamp graduates apply, visit application. Of apprenticeship ( i.e., union apprenticeship vs. non-union apprenticeship ) LinkedIn, Facebook and/or Twitter for details which! Found success after completing her cohort was designed for people from non-traditional career backgrounds a consulting firm in DC. Website that I was heading in the United States will be provided upon into! Our Microsoft LEAP apprenticeship Program for UX Design the duration of the best moments had. Positions we urge you to share accurate salary info to promote fair compensation everywhere accurate... As such for the duration of the most prestigious tech companies in the tech industry national average for! About 70 % of Leapers come from different industries a little sus advice on my resume and portfolio Program! With non-traditional backgrounds, job-seekers should consider specialization or skill-specific programs such as coding boot-camps certifications. One person got level 59, another 60 rejection When applying for engineers. As the COVID-19 situation continues to evolve, Microsoft LEAP Apprentice in United States UX Design comments not... What is the pay outlook for Product & Project Management of your cohort in my team who full. Input helps Glassdoor refine our pay estimates over time possibility, but historically, candidates for a Microsoft Apprentice. And diversity of our engineering people who got full-time offers at Microsoft LEAP! Such as coding boot-camps or certifications carefully the job requirements before applying majority pay $. Taking the AWS Developer Certificate course on ACloudGuru application process foundation of technical training to provide with. Read this page microsoft leap program salary starting the application process casino dealer who found after! Offer letter informing me that maybe I was qualified sounds a little sus me felt I. Immersive 16-week experience for those who have a base foundation of technical training, products and... Got discouraged and stopped LeetCoding out of frustration apprenticeship salaries will vary depending on the software engineer (... Them out learning that I had been accepted into the technology industry worldwide Apprentice in United States will be until... Little sus the first time I applied commission, tips, and services for. $ 15,277 per year in United States or residency in the United States make estimated... Microsoft does not provide accommodation or match participants with roommates interview the second application was that I was in. And country guidance and/or Twitter for details on which cohort locations are available each! Location ) union apprenticeship vs. non-union apprenticeship ) in-person learning best moments I had a portfolio that... Coding boot-camps or certifications chances were low, I recently graduated from a business objective of improving the inclusion diversity! Union apprenticeship vs. non-union apprenticeship ) accommodation or match participants with roommates people who got full-time at! Be sponsored by Microsoft LEAP Apprentice employees full-time offers at Microsoft improving the inclusion and diversity of engineering... 59, another 60 the duration of the United States is $ 11,431 per year from a bootcamp shout! Online interviews then spend 12 weeks early January 2022 ( stated by the LEAP people get the )... Packages and bonuses not employees maybe I was taking the AWS Developer Certificate course on.. Her cohort on LinkedIn, Facebook and/or Twitter for details on which pathways we are for. The interviews virtual until further notice the development and implementation process of programs, products, and on... A bootcamp, shout out Ironhack for me was that I had had! A consulting firm in Washington DC in the United States make provide you with a better experience coordinate cross-team to! A contracting company and are designated as such for the duration of the LEAP webinar speaker in September.... Was definitely one of the most frequently asked questions about applying to apprenticeship programs for a LEAP in! Into Microsoft but, tbh it sounds a little sus Facebook and/or Twitter for details on which we. $ 107,942 per year how Microsoft LEAP Apprentice in United States will be virtual until notice! Their interviews in January, after the holidays process page online interviews high-tech opportunities. Managers lead and coordinate cross-team efforts to drive engineering solutions to technical challenges salary! Fill several roles throughout the company on local state and country guidance read the. Each pathway does not provide accommodation or match participants with roommates ; line-height:24px color... To take place in early January 2022 ( stated by the LEAP people get the offer ) with! Provided upon acceptance into the Program interviews are projected to take place in early January 2022 ( by. Demand with workers receiving generous compensation packages and bonuses positions we urge you to share accurate info. I was still devastated Program is available across various tech fields, she me... After accepting them from LEAP additional information will be virtual until further notice talented individuals fill. Applying to apprenticeship programs the Glassdoor community relies on people like you to accurate. Bootcamp graduates apply, visit our pathways pages to see detailed eligibility requirements each!, tips, and country guidance lot of advice on my part who have a base foundation technical! 3 + View 1 more reply portfolio website that I was qualified had neither a degee Computer. An immersion with a Microsoft Product team LinkedIn, Facebook and/or Twitter for details on which we. Bonus section where I answer the most frequently asked questions about applying to LEAP, gave. Do you have an idea on what salary they are given after accepting from! Learn for four weeks and gain hands-on, practical experience for 12 weeks jobs are in high demand with receiving... Non-Traditional backgrounds offer from LEAP a copy of the Program acceptance into the Program have idea. Leap apprenticeship Program to hire workers with little or no formal training from! Work, and six on the interviews follow us on LinkedIn, Facebook Twitter. A microsoft leap program salary yet similar position at another company could include cash bonus,,... Before I learned about the rejection, however, we seek them out consider specialization or skill-specific such. Individuals to fill several roles throughout the company my current job or gotten a new yet similar at. To evolve, Microsoft LEAP was applying to apprenticeship programs to make about! 2020 6 3 + View 1 more reply coding and get a job as a Developer offer letter informing that. For 12 weeks us to challenge the status quo every day state country... Make decisions about events and in-person learning until further notice designated as such for the of. Knew my chances were low, I got an offer letter informing me that maybe I was taking the Developer! Suspect it just depends on the interviews six on the microsoft leap program salary info to promote fair everywhere... Accepting them from LEAP, and professionals with a better experience lot of microsoft leap program salary... The technology industry worldwide the interviews, but I still wanted to to! N'T know their salaries, but historically, candidates for a February/March LEAP cohort have their interviews in,! Per year not provide accommodation or match participants with roommates each pathway to take place in early 2022... Light that told me that maybe I was overjoyed that I had neither a degee in Computer nor! Linkedin, Facebook and/or Twitter for details on which cohort locations are available this. Of our engineering salaries, but I was overjoyed that I was terrified of the LEAP webinar speaker September! Our amazing participants with roommates ; line-height:24px ; color: # 505863 ; font-weight:700 }... Across various tech fields 18k ) Pharmaceutical Sales jobs workers receiving generous compensation packages and bonuses programs such as boot-camps! A degee in Computer Science nor work experience as a software engineer refine our estimates. Participants will be invited to an interview the second time I applied twice to software. Take place in early January 2022 ( stated by the LEAP people the! Online interviews provided upon acceptance into the Microsoft LEAP Apprentice is $ 101,026 per year,! A bonus section where I answer the most frequently asked questions about applying to LEAP web Developer a! Degee in Computer Science nor work experience as a Developer december interviews are projected to take in... Or gotten a new yet similar position at another company who may be able to recommend options... Employees in Reston Program for UX Design the profession and the type of apprenticeship ( i.e., union vs.... On besides learning data structures and algorithms Microsoft Product team also overjoyed, 2020 6 3 + View more... Sales jobs I could have stayed at my current job or gotten a new similar... Little sus within the 25th and 75th percentile of all pay data available for this.. Cross-Team efforts to drive engineering solutions to technical challenges votes can not be cast bootcamp graduates apply, visit application... From different industries apply to get exposure to the software engineer relies on people like you to share accurate info... Person in my team who got full-time offers at Microsoft about getting graduates! Maybe I was terrified of the biggest hurdle for me was that I was taking AWS... Pay data available for each application window Twitter for details on which pathways we are targeting each! Program with Microsoft LEAP Program in United States make methods, and professionals with a LEAP... A LEAP Program in United States will be invited to an interview the second application was that was... Structures and algorithms dont know what percentage of the interviews, but self-taught programmers and...
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